[Rafale]

[Kovy]

!! ???  et bah dis donc , je suis juste parti bouffer ... et PAF ! une page en plus ...

 

  vraiment désolé , mais je crois bien que j ai tripé , tout seul ....  j étais persuadé , que le capteur juste devant le canard n était pas noir , et que , ( certainement lu , dans un dsi ou truc du genre et bien sur , impossible de remettre la main dessus :-[ ) après des recherche , sur de nouveau matériaux plus performant , il avait été changez ..(  c est récent mais j arrive pas a me rappeler le nom ...)

  

  alors j ai regardé  toute les photos que j avais , et a chaque  fois noir !!  et la je me suis dit que fallait que je me repose ... :-X ,

JUSQU A  ce que je tombe la dessus :

 

 

mais , vu que  c est la seule .... me demande quelle age elle a ... ou alors  c était pour des essais ...

 

   désolé , pour le quiproquo :D

 

C'est le proto M02 qui fait des essais d'emport, donc les antennes spectra sont probablement de simples caches.

Modifié le 10 septembre 2014 par Kovy

[pascal]

dites moi ôtez-moi d'un doute le TELEMIR (liaison IR entre la centrale inertielle du PA et celle de l'avion en vue de son recalage avant catapultage) n'était-il pas le propre des standard M F1 ? Ce qui d'ailleurs rendait les F1 impropres à l'emploi sur PA US car sur ceux ci ils ne pouvaient pas recaler leur centrale (les US font çà par GPS et les Rafale M F2 et s. aussi désormais) donc ils ne pouvaient même pas démarrer ...

[Nenel]

C'est le proto M02 qui fait des essais d'emport, donc les antennes spectra sont probablement de simples caches.

J'irais jusqu'à dire que le M02 n'a pas de spectra.

dites moi ôtez-moi d'un doute le TELEMIR (liaison IR entre la centrale inertielle du PA et celle de l'avion en vue de son recalage avant catapultage) n'était-il pas le propre des standard M F1 ? Ce qui d'ailleurs rendait les F1 impropres à l'emploi sur PA US car sur ceux ci ils ne pouvaient pas recaler leur centrale (les US font çà par GPS et les Rafale M F2 et s. aussi désormais) donc ils ne pouvaient même pas démarrer ...

Pas de doute à avoir, Pascal, tu dis vrai.

[prof.566]

Moins sexy, mais surement aussi important : simulateur 3D pour l'entrainement à la MCO

 

 

 

SPECIAL ADS SHOW – LE MCO AÉRONAUTIQUE EN 3D : INAUGURATION DE RAMSES

http://www.operationnels.com/2014/09/10/special-ads-show-le-mco-aeronautique-en-3d-inauguration-de-ramses/

[Patrick]

Bien vu ;-) Ce rafale là est au fond de l'eau, ainsi que 3 autres.

"Or are they?"

 

 

Edit : non sans rire, les épaves doivent être en morceaux (ou pas ?) mais on a rien récupéré du tout ?

Modifié le 11 septembre 2014 par Patrick

[pascal]

a mon avis s'il y avait du ménage à faire il a été fait

 

il y a longtemps l'ADLA fit appel à l'équipe Cousteau pour récupérer des éléments sensibles d'un MIV A des FAS perdu en Méditerranée

[Gallium nitride]

Je crois que c'est la CEPHISMER qui s'occupe de ce genre de job en général mais cela doit être assez coûteux et réservé aux épaves "sensibles". Ceci dit, j'imagine que l'US Navy aimerait bien avoir son Rafale à désosser car ils en ont vu de très près et cela les a sans doute émoustillés. Pour un objet de plus de 10 tonnes, il est plus simple d'éparpiller façon puzzle que de remonter je pense.

http://www.philippe.tailliez.net/IMG/historique_cephismer.pdf

sinon Dassault Systèmes collabore avec le DRASSM pour l'imagerie 3D appliquée aux fouilles archéologiques sous-marines.

http://www.toulon.maville.com/actu/actudet_-Operation-Lune-a-la-decouverte-de-l-epave-cachee-du-Roi-Soleil_12357-2218649_actu.Htm.

Hors sujet mais à noter également le formidable travail de Dassault systèmes sur le site Paris3D.

http://paris.3ds.com/#Patrimoine
 

Modifié le 11 septembre 2014 par Gallium nitride

[Patrick]

Diablement intéressant tout ça ! Merci pour ces infos.

[DrSomnath999]

“...Rafale is the best fighter plane in the world” - Air Chief Marshal Denis Mercier

By Claude Arpi

 

 

Appointed as the Air Force Chief of Staff (CEMAA) on September 17, 2012, at the age of 53, General Denis Mercier had joined the French Air Force academy in 1979 and qualified as a fighter pilot in 1983. With 182 combat missions and more than 3,000 flying hours (mostly on Mirage F1C and Mirage 2000C) throughout his career, he has acquired extensive experience both as an operational commander and as a fighter pilot. In 2008, he was appointed Commander of the French Air Force Academy in Salon de Provence. Prior to becoming Air Chief, he was posted as a senior Military Advisor in the Ministry of Defence.

Claude Arpi met him on his return from Jodhpur where the Indo-French joint exercises ‘Garuda V’ were being held. That day, General Mercier flew a Sukhoi-30 MKI, while his Indian counterpart, Air Chief Marshal Arup Raha flew a Rafale. Excerpts from the Interview

 

 

LONG article  only posting few interesting parts

 

........Yet, there is great hope that with the present government things will move faster.

 

I am personally convinced that the Rafale is the best fighter plane in the world. I would therefore be delighted to see other major Air Forces being equipped with the Rafale. This is my take on the issue.............

 

 

........

This year, all temperature records have been broken in Jodhpur. Did the heat have an impact on the current Garuda exercise?

 

I have been asked this question already. In fact, the squadron that we deployed is permanently based in the United Arab Emirates. Therefore, the crew was not daunted by the heat in Jodhpur given their everyday experience. I recently went to Africa, where the temperature also reaches 50 degrees. So, one thing that we are certain about is that our aircraft can stand the heat very well, and I am tempted to say, the electronic equipment actually likes the heat. The only limitation in this regard is the human limit. The risk with these staggering heats is human fatigue. But the equipment has no problem, provided it is adequately shielded.........

 

.......Can you envisage other collaborations with India? At a certain stage, for example, it had been considered to develop the engine of the Tejas, the Kaveri, in collaboration…

Our cooperation is well under way at the tactical and operational levels, and has even reached new heights thanks to the Garuda exercises. In Jodhpur, I realised that we had never reached such a high level during previous editions, because we have been building this inter-operability over time, and this feeling was obviously shared by aircrew from both sides. What needs to be done next is a meeting of both Chiefs of Staff. I think it is important. I will invite the Indian Air Chief to see how we can make further progress in our cooperation.

…I have just drawn up a strategic plan for the French Air Force, which lays out our priorities. We discussed this briefly, the Indian Air Force seems to be doing the same and I realise that we certainly have things to share.

We need to sit around a table and exchange our views on the challenges ahead. Following the publication of the French White Paper, I have just drawn up a strategic plan for the French Air Force, which lays out our priorities. We discussed this briefly, the Indian Air Force seems to be doing the same and I realise that we certainly have things to share. Viewing things from this angle; the sharing of our operational experiences and priorities might lead us to consider doing more together, which may also involve an industrial dimension. But our role as Chiefs of Staff is to start by reflecting on the nature of air power within our respective air forces beyond 2020. This will lead us to the rest.........

 

........

Some questions about France now. What did the French Air Force learn from its latest campaigns in Libya or in Mali?

In my view, the latest campaigns have demonstrated one thing: the first and foremost duty of an Air Force is to be responsive. We already possess this responsiveness through our two permanent missions. The first one is Air Defence, which requires us to react in a matter of minutes to ensure the sovereignty and protection of national airspace. The second is the Nuclear Deterrence mission, which also imposes stringent readiness constraints. It has to be assured according to a permanent alert posture decided by the President of the Republic.

Besides this, in the case of the first operations in Libya we were required to react within 24 hours. We were able to respond at such short notice thanks to our two permanent missions, whose execution implies constantly maintaining several air bases on alert, as well as information systems and command and control centres.

In the Mali operation, in order to stop the jihadists and to prevent them from regrouping and threatening the capital Bamako, we had to react in less than 48 hours. That is why we decided to strike directly from France, with a very long-range raid of almost ten hours of flight and more than 20 targets to strike. We had to do it.

 

We have also been close to performing other missions at other theatres of operation, each time at very short notice, within just a few hours. When we were asked to provide reassurance by participating in the air policing of the Baltic States, we also responded very quickly.

These operations have taught me one important lesson: I am now looking at ways to continue organising our Air Force so that, in addition to our two permanent missions, we possess this capability for immediate response from our national territory. Because the new capabilities we have today, the tactical and strategic airlift as well as our combat capability, now provide us with the required degree of responsiveness at very long range.

 

That is why, during a recent exercise, I wanted the Rafale to be deployed directly from the French mainland to the French Island of La Réunion, over 8,000 km away in the Southern Indian Ocean......

 

How long was that flight?

 

It took 10 hours and 40 minutes to reach there and 10 hours and 50 minutes to fly back.

 

 

Did you break a record?

 

Yes, we did. It was not just a long ferry flight; we also performed a simulated strike on the way. I wanted to demonstrate our ability to do this already now. We have also demonstrated our ability to ferry a Fennec helicopter with the new Airbus A400M military transport aircraft to French Guyana (South America) in record time. The A400M has also flown to Djibouti in the Horn of Africa and to Mali in the Sahel-Sahara region of Africa. The one key to all of this is the reorganisation of our air bases so that they can maintain their level of responsiveness, not only for the Air Defence and Nuclear Deterrence missions, but also for Strategic Projection abroad.

 

In the backdrop of on-going joint (tri-service) reforms, this requires us to reconsider a number of things, in some cases reverting to past concepts, such as actually operating from our air bases to launch air strikes, albeit thousands of kilometres away. The other key element that I wished to demonstrate, and recent operations have proved us right – which is always better – is the Command and Control Centre. Based in Lyon, it controls Air Defence missions over the French homeland, as well as all the operations we are currently conducting in Africa. All missions, whether in France or abroad, are now controlled from Lyon. The planning and control, no matter where the operation is in the world, is undertaken from Lyon in real time. This gives us an unequalled level of responsiveness, which no one else possesses in Europe, and, indeed, elsewhere – apart from the United States.

 

I really wanted to demonstrate this, and we have succeeded much faster than expected, which gives me great satisfaction. Because this centre is manned for Air Defence, I can ring up tomorrow, or in an hour’s time, and I’m sure to find people there at any time. I can tell them “I want this mission planned” and, whilst carrying on with Air Defence, they will plan a mission thousands of kilometres away. They are able to do this with competent people, who are on the watch round the clock.......

 

..........

Does the use of drones, as you have done in Mali, interest the Indian side?

 

Yes, I have been asked about our use of drones and our perspectives about their use in the future. There are different types of drones. Those used by our Air Force are the Medium-Altitude Long-Endurance (MALE) type, which can be sent thousands of kilometres away, which can fly 24 hours or more, which are remotely operated through satellites and whose images and data we can receive via satellite. These drones are of interest to Air Forces, as they provide a global and permanent vision of a theatre. But using such drones is complex, it requires mastering the networks. The Indian Air Force has this required mastery of networks and of managing complex missions, India is therefore absolutely capable of doing the same (while other Air Forces would find it more problematic). This is why, although there are still only few MALE drones today, I believe we will see more and more of this type in the future. But being able to operate this type of drone requires a comprehensive mastery of air operations, including the satellite segment. In other words, a certain maturity is needed......

 

 

.......Which advice or which message would you like to give the Indian Air Force?

I have no advice to give to the Indian Air Force. They have a great Air Force. Two things I would like to tell them: first, we should try to enhance our mutual knowledge, to know each other’s perspectives better, and to develop our cooperation beyond the Garuda exercise and beyond the operational domain. Second and last, I personally believe in the qualities of the Rafale, and I would therefore be delighted to see this great Indian Air Force operating the same plane as we do.....

 

Merci beaucoup, mon general!

http://www.indiandefencereview.com/news/rafale-is-the-best-fighter-plane-in-the-world-air-chief-marshal-denis-mercier-2/2/

[Gallium nitride]

A love story is beginning.

 

L'Inde et la France ont tout pour mettre en place une synergie efficace en terme d'entrainement et d'optimisation de leurs armées respectives. Ce serait vraiment dommage de passer à côté pour des considérations politiques.

[DrSomnath999]

]FROM AIR & COSMOS N 2420 12 september 2014

 

 

The M1O flies again 

 

First Rafale FI transformed 

 

This is the first Rafale comes to ... the second time sailors of the sky, this year the Navy Rafale M10 was also the first to pass into the hands of the industrial workshop air Clermont-Ferrand , before returning to the assembly line in Merignac Dassault Aviation: the manufacturer did not find anything wrong with this cell reworked by someone other than himself, before handing it in flight. The transformation program ten Rafale F3 Navy Rafale F1 to be completed in 2016.

 

 

from pg 23

 

 

SUMMER UNIVERSITY OF DEFENSE 

 

A SCHOOL HIGH VOLTAGE 

 

AGES 8 AND 9 September. ALL RESPONSIBLE FOR DEFENSE CAME TOGETHER IN BORDEAUX. FOR THE 12th EDITION OF THE UNIVERSITY SUMMER OF DEFENSE IS THE AIR FORCE THAT WAS THE HOST OF THIS APPOINTMENT MUST BECOME THE COMMUNITY FOR DEFENCE 

 

A light civilian aircraft suspected of taking aerial pictures of a French nuclear power plant, triggering the alert Command Air Defence and Air Operations (CDAOA), based in Lyon. From Bordeaux, the BA 106 Merignac connected to Lyon, General Jean-Jacques Bord, Chief of Staff 

 

the CDAOA, gives orders: "Intercept. • Immediately a fighter Rafale, in alert posture off from Mont-de-Marsan. Almost simultaneously, another situation causes the red lights: a theater of operation away at Sahcl a Reaper drone flying surveillance detects hostile behavior by an armed group, which installs IEDs (improvised explosive devices ) 

 

on a supply route widely used. LIVE from Bordeaux, Commander CDAOA gives its ordres.Très quickly, a Rafale leaves to treat the target. Reconstitution, very realistic, impressive academics: top CEOs (Dassault, 'Thales, Safran, DCNS, Nexter ...), Joint Chiefs of Staff or parliamentarians. Dynamic démonstrarion, who recalled that the French Air Force is a year of employment in high demand and responsive. 

 

BACK INEVITABLE. 

 

Appointment of inevitable return of senior defense officials, the Summer University of Defense (UED), organized by 

Committees of Defense of the Senate and the National Assembly meets each year military, parliamentarians, industrialists and journalists. 

 

For its 2014 edition the Air Force chose Bordeaux, an important location with the air base 106 of Merignac but also the integrated structure operational maintenance of flight equipment of Defense (Sim mad, cf. A & C No. 2419) and aviation repair shop in Bordeaux. The region is also a location of numerous aircraft manufacturers, including Dassault, with an assembly plant in Merignac. 

 

The year of the Air, with the theme "Acting & react," released all scs capacity, almost. The importance of the command centers and coordination of the transmissions, but also its various means: reconstitution of a task CSAR (Combat Search and Rescue) by air commandos filed by a Caracal and escorted by two helicopter gunships tiger light Aviation of the Army (Alat) breathtaking demonstration of the capabilities of the Rafale in flight. But also a multitude of devices exposed by static: Transall, Rafale or Mirage in various configurations, special forces, maintenance ... 

 

STRATEGIC SURPRISE. 

 

The Defence Minister, Jean-Yves Le Drian, in his address, gave a disturbing picture of the threat that France, Europe and the world are facing. "Three major fronts insecurity

 

 

 

 

 

now inevitable. "Jihadist terrorism, said the second generation, which operates in Africa and the Middle East. 1l This is al-Qaida, of course, but especially today of the Islamic state and the profound destabilization of Libya. Second threat, "the risk of weakness, that the disappearance of the attributes of a state, the emergence dEtats bankrupt", like Mali and the Central African Republic. These situations are "fertile ground for crises, civil war and all trades." The third front is the "threat of force". These are areas where the rise of budgets 

 

military is accompanied by stirring up nationalist sentiments and territorial tensions. The actions of Russia to Ukraine are referred here directly. 

 

TOMORROW LIBYA. 

 

These fronts appointed by the Minister of Defence show more than ever, that the preservation of the military tool is essential. And Jean-Yves Le Drian to say that it is urgent and vital to France, in the context of surprise, to maintain its position of strategic power in Europe. A new front matter should be open. The Minister of 

 

Defense with warning about h deteriorating situation in I.ibyc which could go very quickly under djiha-diste control. The dispositifBarkhane, that is to say, the French military presence in the Sahel-sahalienne, might have to go up to the Libyan border in response to this situation. "We need action," he insisted. Already stretched (Central African Republic, Mali ...) the French army should then see a new theater of operations opened, proving, if proof were needed, that strategic surprise prevails and that the armed forces must be ready. At all. 

 

This finding geostrategic instability justifies the effort of France in the investment of its defense. Jean-Yves Le Drian has also said in his closing speech: France took "the decision to give up any critical capacity, with the consequent need to continue our investment effort that primarily benefit instead the defense industry. "

 

TENSIONS. 

 

And working groups discussed sensitive subjects. Budgetary constraints, of course, were the focus of discussions. For if the French armies are preserved thanks to a law of "coherent military planning and maintains all the capabilities of our armed * according to Minister of Defense b, when it comes to long-term action, the decrease workforce becomes a difficult problem. Human resource in high demand that today the staff is under pression.Tout like the hardware, the OLS (Operational maintenance) devices at very different ages is a real puzzle that requires innovative solutions. Uncertainty, however, was on everyone's mind regarding compliance with the military planning law. Indeed, the Ministry of Finance, in his hunt for savings, managed to scrounge credits on the defense budget while promising exceptional resources in compensation. Alas, everyone, and the Court of Auditors in mind, agrees to recognize: the 2014-2019 LPM, these exceptional resources from the sale of real estate or frequency of way, and which represent about 7 billion €, will not be the rendezvous, threatening the de facto fragile balance of LPM. 

 

 

| William Belan and Emmanuel Huberdeau

 

 

 

ANYONE WITH BETTER ENGLISH TRANSLATE PLEASE DO CONTRIBUTE 

[DrSomnath999]

A love story is beginning.

 

L'Inde et la France ont tout pour mettre en place une synergie efficace en terme d'entrainement et d'optimisation de leurs armées respectives. Ce serait vraiment dommage de passer à côté pour des considérations politiques.

France has always supported politcally india in every thing

 

1) support in security council

2) Didnt put sanctions against us during 1998 nuclear test 

3) didnt interfere in India's internal matters

 

Meanwhile those crook British have recently interfering in our internal matters

they are discussing kashmir issue  in their parliament complete interference in our internal matters

 

They are taking out frustrations on us why we havenot choose typhoon as MMRCA winner

 

French

 

La France a toujours soutenu politiquement l'Inde en toute chose 

 

1) l'appui en conseil de sécurité 

2) n'ai pas mis les sanctions contre nous en 1998 des essais nucléaires 

3) na pas s'ingérer dans les affaires internes de l'Inde 

 

En attendant ces escroc britannique ont récemment s'ingérer dans nos affaires internes 

ils discutent question du Cachemire dans leur parlement interférences complète dans nos affaires internes 

 

Ils prennent des frustrations sur nous pourquoi nous choisissons havenot typhon gagnant MMRCA

 

CHEERS

[Gallium nitride]

Dear Dr,

You do not need to translate french magazines as we are on a french forum. 

If you want us to help you for translation, you may try to use the inboard private messaging service. I will be glad to help you if you wish.

And thx for supporting the Rafale. I am quite sure it's the best choice India could make and I hope that the signature will soon come.

 

By the way I'm not quite certain that other languages than French are authorized here. Did you ask yet?

[pascal]

@Dr Somnath

 

You can't reproduce a magazine on this forum. It's clear ?

Il faut un peu se méfier de ce qui est parfois écrit

 

La réception du M 10 par les services étatiques après la sortie des chaînes a été plus longue que prévu.

[Gallium nitride]

Il me semble que les autres iront un peu plus vite car Dassault avait besoin d'avaliser l'opération effectuée en Auvergne par une entreprise tierce.

Modifié le 12 septembre 2014 par Gallium nitride

[zx]

ca bosse à la marine, ca sent le go for war

 

Huit avions Rafale de la marine nationale à la BA 125 d'Istres

 

http://www.maritima.info/actualites/societe/istres/5974/huit-avions-rafale-de-la-marine-nationale-a-la-ba-125-d-istres.html

Modifié le 12 septembre 2014 par zx

[2020]

ca bosse à la marine, ca sent le go for war

Huit avions Rafale de la marine nationale à la BA 125 d'Istres

http://www.maritima.info/actualites/societe/istres/5974/huit-avions-rafale-de-la-marine-nationale-a-la-ba-125-d-istres.html

yes j ai posté ds le post guerre contre EIIL .

la 12f et 17f sont prêtent également.

[Fox3Shots]

ca bosse à la marine, ca sent le go for war

 

Huit avions Rafale de la marine nationale à la BA 125 d'Istres

 

http://www.maritima.info/actualites/societe/istres/5974/huit-avions-rafale-de-la-marine-nationale-a-la-ba-125-d-istres.html

 

C'était prévu depuis hyper longtemps cette manip' à Istres. Rien à voir avec les évènements récents.

[Nenel]

Pour ceux que cela interressent, nos amis de delta reflex ont eu la gentillesse, avec beaucoup de recoupement je pense,de mettre en ligne les positions de tous les Rafale de l'AA.

SAINT-DIZIER

103 104 105 106 108 115 117 121 124 130 135 141 142

144 145 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 315 317 319

321 322 324 326 327 330 331 332 333 334 336 337 338

340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347

MONT-DE-MARSAN

102 109 110 111 112 114 116 119 122 123 125 126 127

128 129 132 133 134 137 138 139 143 304 305 318 323

339

AL DHAFRA

113 131 136 140 328 329

N’DJAMENA

107 118 120

ISTRES ( DGA-EV )

101 301 302

CLERMONT-FERRAND ( AIA )

303 320 335

MERIGNAC ( DASSAULT )

348 349 350

CHATEAUDUN

314 325

[Picdelamirand-oil]

Pour ceux que cela interressent, nos amis de delta reflex ont eu la gentillesse, avec beaucoup de recoupement je pense,de mettre en ligne les positions de tous les Rafale de l'AA.

SAINT-DIZIER

103 104 105 106 108 115 117 121 124 130 135 141 142

144 145 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 315 317 319

321 322 324 326 327 330 331 332 333 334 336 337 338

340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347

MONT-DE-MARSAN

102 109 110 111 112 114 116 119 122 123 125 126 127

128 129 132 133 134 137 138 139 143 304 305 318 323

339

AL DHAFRA

113 131 136 140 328 329

N’DJAMENA

107 118 120

ISTRES ( DGA-EV )

101 301 302

CLERMONT-FERRAND ( AIA )

303 320 335

MERIGNAC ( DASSAULT )

348 349 350

CHATEAUDUN

314 325

 

Ca fait beaucoup, je croyais qu'il y en avait qui étaient stockés pour homogénéiser le nombre d'heure de vol?

[Nenel]

Ca fait beaucoup, je croyais qu'il y en avait qui étaient stockés pour homogénéiser le nombre d'heure de vol?

C'est le cas, les 2 à Châteaudun.

Et puis à St Di. Il y a 2 escadrons plus la formation, à Mont. en plus du Neu-Neu il y a le CEAM .

[pascal]

normalement Châteaudun devrait accueillir environ un avion par mois d'ici fin 2015

 

le faible rythme des livraisons et le fait que certains avions aient peu volé une fois leur affectation en escadron réalisée (pannes, chantiers de modifications, stockage de courte durée sur bases) peut expliquer a priori que c'est seulement 7 ans après leur entrée en service que les premiers appareils partent à Châteaudun en stockage de plus longue durée.

[Picdelamirand-oil]

C'est le cas, les 2 à Châteaudun.

Et puis à St Di. Il y a 2 escadrons plus la formation, à Mont. en plus du Neu-Neu il y a le CEAM .

 

2 à Châteaudun ça ne colle pas avec les explications du taux de 44% de disponibilité expliqué par Olybrius.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?137433-Rafale-News&p=7316672&viewfull=1#post7316672

[TMor]

Pour ceux que cela interressent, nos amis de delta reflex ont eu la gentillesse, avec beaucoup de recoupement je pense,de mettre en ligne les positions de tous les Rafale de l'AA.

C'est une très bonne idée, que j'ai moi-même abandonnée dans ma liste, parce qu'en fait, les avions changent de place de temps en temps.

[Nenel]

On apprend aussi que les B348 et 349 sont près à être livrés et que le 350 a fait son premier vol cette semaine.