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Un moteur à ions est un moteur qui produit sa force de propulsion en projetant des ions à très haute vitesse. déjà utilisé avec la sonde SMART. http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moteur_ionique VASIMR est un moteur à propulsion plasma et aussi une alternative a la propulsion ionique jugé lente http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/VASIMR Revons un peu : un vaisseau de 20 tonnes, alimentant un propulseur VASIMR avec 200 MW, mettrait Mars à seulement 39 jours de voyage de la Terre[6]). raaaaah ! 8)

Je ne pense pas que la propulsion nucleaire sera l'avenir, du moins pas directement, l'avenir appartient a la techno des moteurs magnetico plasma, VASIMR, un gaz chauffé a très haute temperature grace a des supra conducteur produira le plasma et propulsera le vaisseau, l'avantage est qu'il faut une très petite quantité pour assurer la propulsion, ca permet d'atteindre de grande vitesse, ca pourra diviser le temps du trajet terre mars, par 3 ou par 4. Par contre il a besoin d'electricite, qui peut etre produite par des panneau solaire ou une pile nucleaire. C'est l'avenir, surtout qu'ils commencent a multiplier sa puissance, il est prevu qu'un proto sera teste sur l'iss. le site http://www.adastrarocket.com/PlasmaRockets.html une demo, c'est pas l'enterprise de star trek, mais c'est un début, on est à l'age de pierre dans ce domaine. =) <object width="480" height="295"><param name="movie" value="http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVsgSjm_vXg&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVsgSjm_vXg&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="295"></embed></object> <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=-537--RJb80&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=-537--RJb80&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

hmmm, le super puma date des années 60, on a pourtant fait un ec 725 performant et tout beau, personne ne s'en plaint, c'est sur ils ont tout revu, . =) on peut très bien développer une nouvelle version sur la base de l'alize et complètement réadapté aux nouvelles missions.

Pourquoi pas un alize NG, c'est une bonne base, il faudrait modernise toute l'electronique pour la surveillance, il est biplace ? Mais 1850 km d'autonomie et pas de gun.

Petite question, Les radars au sols ou sur les navires ne peuvent pas détecter le f22 ? ils sont pourtant plus puissant que dans un rafale ou un eurofighte, ils peuvent informer un raffy sur sa position et il peut le shooter ?

:lol: J'attends les F35B qui arrivent chez nos voisins anglais pour ouvrir le fil, on pourra en discuter =)

Pour l'A10, j'ai lu 10 Million de dollar, sauf si c'est une erreur

Ca s'est passé en 1996, depuis ce jour, ca se bisbille dans le ciel greco/turc et dans les fora et youtube >:( Le 8 octobre 1996, un Mirage 2000 grec abat un F-16 turc[1]. Suite à une violation de l'espace aérien grec, les Mirage 2000 envoyés pour intercepter les intrus sont engagés en combat tournoyant par des F-16 turcs. L'un des Mirage tire alors un missile Magic, atteignant un F-16D (biplace) qui s'écrase en mer. Un des pilotes du F-16 est mort, l'autre a pu s'éjecter et a été secouru par un hélicoptère grec.

La première question était de savoir si il y'avait un 'equivalent francais au super tucano pouvant faire de la surveillance ou de la reconnaissance jour/nuit et du soutien leger, faire de l'anti guerrilla, maintenant ca devient un fil pour tous les turbo prop. Le rafale est un super avion, mais c'est cher et lourd pour certaines petites missions. 60 ME vs 6M$ Pour l'instant, j'ai noté qu'il y a le pilatus, tucano, bronco après on tombe dans les mini jet si j'avais su je l'aurai appelé turbo prop, trop tard, sauf si un modo sympa peut faire une moulinette :'( Pour l'A10, c'est surtout un avion d'assaut pas cher.

Méchant chinois >:(, ils veulent acheter les fréquences prevues pour galileo, et on se retrouve n***é. http://www.iht.com/articles/2009/03/22/technology/galileo23.php While Galileo was falling behind schedule, the Chinese were developing their system, Compass/Beidou. Chinese officials have told the International Telecommunications Union, the United Nations agency that allocates radio spectrum frequencies for satellite use, that China plans to transmit signals on the wavelength that the European Union wants to use for Galileo's Public Regulated Service. An encrypted frequency for governmental, immigration, public safety and potentially military use, the Public Regulated Service would operate alongside Galileo's main operations, which are intended to be commercial. Under the International Telecommunications Union's policies, the first country to start using a specific frequency is granted priority status, and later service providers transmitting on the same band must ensure that their broadcasts do not interfere with previously authorized signals. Because some of China's satellites are expected to begin transmitting before the Europeans can get to the frequency, China would effectively be able to gain ownership of it, meaning that Europe would be unable to use the wavelength unless it received China's permission. Even then, some European Union members, such as France, are raising security-related concerns that their encrypted signal might be compromised. An agreement with the United States in 2004 on the Public Regulated Service makes it virtually impossible for Europe to move this signal to another frequency. Two rounds of negotiations to resolve this "frequency overlay" issue have gone nowhere, bogged down by mutual suspicion and misunderstandings. "Our sense is that in the last few years the Chinese developed their own ideas for their own system and have not really talked to anybody else — not to us, nor to the Americans and nor to the Russians," said Paul Verhoef, who heads the Galileo project at the European Commission. "The Chinese came to us with a couple of details and we then needed to go into a discussion, which at first they were reluctant to do. We had to point out problems, not just for us and the Americans, but for the Chinese as well." Mr. Verhoef expressed confidence that the two sides would resolve the issue, though he gave no time frame. "It's late in the day to look for solutions," he said. "It's taking a bit of a political profile, which is not normal for commercial systems." The negotiations are further complicated by European worries that China may plan to try to compete with Galileo for commercial business. Mr. Verhoef said it had indicated that Compass would be for military use. "If we would be able to come to an agreement with China that our systems were to be interoperable, we would still be interested in having cooperation," he said. "If, on the other hand, they are not forthcoming in discussions on compatibility, then we would have to think how we would proceed."

un petit coup a boire, =) <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61qrMlCBOlI&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param'>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61qrMlCBOlI&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61qrMlCBOlI&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Qu'elle est la vitesse que peut se permettre un rafale en faisant du rase motte pour atteindre une cible ? Il peut prendre l'autoroute ? =) voir dans retro ;)

C'est vrai que le tiffy doit avoir le meme probleme, il n'est pas un avion de 5eme generation.

une belle image du PAK FA , synthese of course http://www.npo-saturn.ru/!new/inc/img.php?q=100&p=!new/img/photo/1180608585_Sukhoi_T50_sc2.jpg&s=1024&uncscale=true

Bientôt, les avions ou les missiles ne pourront plus se détecter entre eux, il faudra alors se bagarrer à l'ancienne, à vue et aux guns dans des combats tournoyant comme dans la guerre de 14-18. :P :P =) :lol:

=) conclusion, puis que nous n'avons aucune reponse Lol, reste plus qu'a developper un rafale stealth pour la superiorite aerienne pour rivaliser avec le F22 et le futur PAK FA et le JXX ou le futur furtif japonais <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRPlnT-PD0A&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRPlnT-PD0A&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2009/03/19/324085/aerospace-primes-show-suborbital-military-transport.html Potential military applications for suborbital spaceflight are being studied by some of the biggest players in the US defence industry. Northrop Grumman, Pratt & Whitney and Alliant Techsystems (ATK) have all made suborbital transport proposals in closed sessions to the US government's National Space Security Office (NSSO), Flight International can reveal. As reported earlier this month (Flight International, 10-16 March), an NSSO technology forum at Lackland AFB in Texas from 24-26 February featured proposals from companies associated with suborbital tourism. But it has emerged that several aerospace prime contractors also took part, along with the US Air Force Research Laboratory and space and missile command, and NASA's commercial crew and cargo office. The NSSO is interested in near-term technologies that can launch on 2h notice and deliver within a 2h flight time a 200kg (440lb) payload to a destination 9,250km (5,000nm) away. In February it released a request for information describing this and preferred future capabilities that included 13,360kg payloads being suborbitally delivered into theatre. The 2h response requirement is akin to the Department of Defense's Operationally Responsive Space office's needs. Companies had till 15 March to submit their information. A request for proposals is expected to follow. As well as the aerospace primes, suborbital spaceflight companies also had closed sessions. These included Rocketplane, Xcor Aerospace and Blue Origin, which is developing its suborbital rocket and capsule in secrecy. Blue Origin's general counsel Robert Millman gave a closed session presentation aided by Brett Alexander, Personal Spaceflight Federation president and a consultant to Blue Origin. Alexander also gave a conference presentation about the commercial human spaceflight industry and told Flight International that "all the right people" were there from the DoD, but it is "nowhere near an acquisition". He says Blue Origin spoke about its suborbital activities. E'Prime Aerospace, a company developing rockets using US intercontinental ballistic missile Peacekeeper technology, gave a joint closed session presentation with US Space Plane Systems, which has a lifting body concept that is similar to the NASA Ames Research Center's 1960s M-2 design. E'Prime has struggled with international treaty restrictions on ICBM technology, management board changes and funding challenges. Virgin Galactic only attended as an observer. Under the Operationally Responsive Space office initiative Northrop was contracted to examine launch vehicles in 2006 and in December ATK won a subsystem award for the first satellite. The US Space Plane Systems’ orbital vehicle Eagle Flyer is a concept based on NASA Ames Research Center’s 1960s lifting body M-2 design http://www.flightglobal.com/assets/getAsset.aspx?ItemID=28131

Les anglais commandent leur 3 premier F35B http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2009/03/18/324024/uk-signs-for-first-three-f-35b-joint-strike-fighters.html The UK has kept its commitment to the Lockheed Martin F-35 Joint Strike Fighter programme despite massive pressure on its procurement budget, today signing for its first three production aircraft to support initial operational test and evaluation (IOT&E) of the fifth-generation fighter. Signed during a visit to Washington DC by defence secretary John Hutton, the deal will see the UK take delivery of its first short take-off and vertical landing F-35Bs in 2011, with the aircraft to be drawn from the JSF programme's third low-rate initial production batch To be delivered in 2011-12, the UK aircraft will be assigned to a joint test team for the F-35 in the USA, with the Netherlands also expected to acquire two conventional take-off and landing F-35As to support IOT&E activities. Describing the JSF as "an essential part of our Future Combat Air Capability", Hutton says: "Working alongside their US colleagues, our pilots will gain an unrivalled understanding of this awesome aircraft and its capabilities." As the USA's lone Level 1 partner to the JSF programme, the UK expects to spend £2 billion ($2.79 billion) during the design's ongoing system development and demonstration phase. More than £1.1 billion of this total had been spent by 31 March 2008, according to the UK National Audit Office's Major Projects 2008 report. The MoD declines to reveal the value of its 18 March contract, citing "commercial sensitivity", but confirms that the sum is in addition to its previously identified £2 billion investment in the programme. To be acquired under its Joint Combat Aircraft project, the UK's future F-35Bs will replace its current BAE Systems Harrier GR7/9s, operated by the Royal Air Force/Royal Navy Joint Force Harrier organisation. Up to 138 of the aircraft are expected to be purchased. Up to 32 of the aircraft will be deployed aboard each of the RN's two 65,000t Future Aircraft Carrier vessels, and today's IOT&E acquisition "will enable the MoD to move forward in developing the Carrier Strike capability", Hutton says.

c'est quoi l'intérêt d'une telle manoeuvre ? pour echapper aux torpilles ?

avec un M88 9t avec de la poussée vectorielle "light", ca peut ameliorer les choses face a un F22 ? un aesa et meteor en fight bvr missile n'equilibre pas les choses ? si effectivement qu'un scenario se produise avec un F22, son equivalent russe, un PAKFA, pourrait nous poser aussi les memes problemes

quelques details de plus sur aviationweek http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story.jsp?id=news/Silent031709.xml&headline=Boeing%20Unveils%20New%20Stealthy%20F-15&channel=defense Company officials hope the new aircraft will garner up to 190 orders, extending the F-15 line beyond the current backlog of 38 aircraft for South Korea and Singapore. Since the company lost the Joint Strike Fighter contest to Lockheed Martin, the future of its St. Louis manufacturing facility has been uncertain. Continued F-15 sales, as well as additional orders for F/A-18E/Fs and EA-18Gs, are the only work in the foreseeable future for the plant. Major design changes in the new "Silent Eagle" version include internal bays within the existing conformal fuel tanks that can carry a variety of air-to-air and air-to-ground weapons. Each tank will be configured to hold two air-to-air missiles, including the AIM-9 and AIM-120 or a combination of the two.For the air-to-ground mission, 1,000- and 500-pound Joint Direct Attack Munitions can be carried or four 250-pound Small Diameter Bombs per tank. Weapons loadout can also be split between the AIM-120 and JDAM for a multirole mission.The Silent Eagle configuration includes 15-degree outward-canted V-tails - a shift away from the characteristic vertical fins of the F-15 that reduces the radar cross-section. The Mach 2.5 speed of the Strike Eagle is maintained, but the cost is about 180-200 nautical miles of range capability because of the reduce fuel in the conformal tanks, says Brad Jones, program manger for F-15 future programs. The new design includes a digital electronic warfare system (DEWS), made by BAE Systems, that can operate simultaneously with the aircraft's Raytheon active electronically scanned array radar. Stealth coatings, though not yet applied to Boeing's prototype, could be added at a later time. Boeing says the coatings could contibute to an equivalent amount of front-aspect stealth as that offered by Lockheed's F-35. This includes reducing radar returns from sharp edges on the aircraft, including antennae. Stealthiness for the F-15 was explored about a decade ago for the U.S. Air Force as an alternative to the Lockheed-led F-22, but was never pursued. "The internal carriage is what is new. The stealth is not," Jones says, adding "We are not really after the F-22 market or the F-35 market" with this new design. The level of stealthiness exportable on the F-15 is up to the U.S. government to decide, Jones says. Though USAF officials have been given courtesy briefings on the Silent Eagle, talks on stealth exportability have not yet occurred. A radar blocker for engine inlets, already fitted in F/A-18E/Fs, could be added depending on how much radar cross-section reduction is required by the customer and allowed by the government. Jones estimates the cost of a Silent Eagle will be about $100 million per aircraft, including spares, if built new. A retrofit kit including the conformal fuel tanks, DEWS and coatings could be added to existing Strike Eagles, he says. The target market includes South Korea, Singapore, Japan, Israel and Saudi Arabia, Jones says. The first likely customer is South Korea, which is looking for two new fighters, including its F-X Phase III program, which calls for 60 aircraft in the F-15 class. South Korea's Agency for Defense Development is also pushing for a KFX program, which calls for about 120 domestically developed stealth fighters. Jones says coproduction of stealth materials would be subject to U.S. government review and a tough case to sell. Japan and Saudi Arabia are also looking for new F-15-class fighters. And if the Silent Eagle were sold to the Saudis, Israel likely would want a chance to buy the aircraft too to maintain balance of power in the Middle East. Boeing's willingness to integrate indigenous systems, such as electronic warfare suites, onto the Silent Eagle is an option that could be of interest to these customers - especially Israel. Israeli industry was recently rebuffed by U.S. officials unwilling to add foreign EW systems under the F-35 development program. The weapons-carrying fuel tanks, which are affixed to the aircraft with two bolts, and can be removed within about 2.5 hours. Reinstalling the original fuel tanks restores the F-15 to its nonstealthy configuration, which is capable of hauling more and larger weapons, including anti-ship missiles. The Silent Eagle prototype is based on F-15E1, the program's flight test aircraft. To date, it has been outfitted with the conformal tanks and the canted tails, which are for demonstration only and not structurally integrated. The actual canted tails would be added later if a customer requested them. Stealth coatings and engine intake blockers have not been added. Jones says Boeing hopes to begin flight testing the weapons-carrying conformal tanks on the aircraft in the first quarter of next year. Design work on the Silent Eagle concept began in September last year in response to feedback from F--15 customers, he says

Le F15 nouveau est arrivé, avec des caractéristiques de la 5eme generation =) avis aux connaisseurs, bonne dégustation ;) http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2009/03/17/323962/pictures-boeing-unveils-upgraded-f-15-silent-eagle-with-fifth-generation.html PICTURES: Boeing unveils upgraded F-15 Silent Eagle with fifth-generation features Boeing today unveiled a new F-15 prototype aimed at the international market with such "fifth-generation" add-ons as radar absorbent coatings, internal weapons carriage and integrated digital avionics, plus featuring a distinctive V-tail. Improving the fourth generation fighter’s profile on air-to-air radar is Boeing’s key goal for the F-15SE, which the company plans to offer to five foreign countries with an estimated market for 190 orders. Radar absorbent materials added to leading edges are designed to soften the F-15SE’s head-on radar signature. Canting both horizontal stabilizers by 15 degrees is intended to reduce radar returns to the side. Finally, embedding missiles and bombs inside conformal fuel tanks also reduces radar signature in all directions, and allows the F-15SE to perform its warfighting mission even with “clean” wings. Boeing claims the end-result is an aircraft that can match the frontal-aspect stealth profile of any fifth generation fighter in configurations cleared by the US government for export release. “We know we can get to the US government release level for international customers,” said Brad Jones, Boeing’s manager for future F-15 programmes. To be fair, Boeing acknowledges the F-15SE’s stealth improvements do not help against ground-based radar systems, which are critical for waging offensive strikes against opponents armed with surface to air missile systems. Lowering the F-15SE’s thermal signature -- a critical stealthy feature for the Lockheed Martin F-22 – is also not part of Boeing plans. But Boeing said the F-15SE is aimed at international customers more likely to use the aircraft for defensive, counter-air missions, rather than offensive strikes in defended airspace where all-aspect stealth is necessary for survival. Despite the stealth improvements, Boeing insists the F-15SE would not tradeoff sensor or aerodynamic performance. The APG-63(V)3 radar would remain canted slightly forward rather than tilted back, preserving coverage and range at the expense of head-on radar cross section. Moreover, Boeing has designed the F-15SE to also function as a non-stealthy, multi-role aircraft with the F-15E’s full payload of 29,000lbs of weapons. The conformal fuel tanks with the internal weapons bay can be quickly removed after landing, allowing the aircraft to takeoff with a full payload within two hours. Another key feature of the F-15SE is the electronic warfare system. Boeing has selected the BAE Systems digital electronic warfare system (DEWS), which includes a digital radar warning receiver, digital jamming transmitter, integrated countermeasures dispenser and an interference cancellation system. The aircraft could continue to jam enemy radars even as its own radar and RWR continues to operate, Boeing claims. Boeing launched the F-15SE, initially dubbed Project Monty, in September. The company-owned F-15E testbed was quickly modified with the V-tail and conformal fuel tanks to provide a ground-based demonstrator. Flight trials for a risk reduction programme are scheduled to begin in the first quarter of 2010. The first aircraft could be available for delivery to foreign customers three years after a deal is signed. Boeing plans to offer the F-15SE to Japan, South Korea, Singapore, Israel and Saudi Arabia, with all being current F-15 customers. Notionally, Boeing estimates the F-15SE’s cost, including airframe, spares and training, at $100 million each. The F-15’s single-largest customer – the US Air Force – is not officially a sales target for the F-15SE. However, Boeing says that all of the stealth, avionics and structural upgrades can be retrofitted on any existing F-15E. Company officials have briefed three agencies within the US Air Force, including Air Combat Command, but only as a “courtesy”, a Boeing spokeswoman said. See more coverage and photos on the F-15 Silent Eagle at Stephen Trimble's The D.E.W. Line See more images of the F-15 Silent Eagle on AirSpace http://www.flightglobal.com/assets/getAsset.aspx?ItemID=28081

Belle image, mais peut etre déjà poste, j'ai pas vu ! il est pret a decoller pour se mettre en orbite http://www.meretmarine.com/lienobjet.cfm?mer_objet_lien_id=15839&id=109784

il parle de son premier vol cette année, mais il faut se méfier des annonces http://fr.rian.ru/business/20090212/120104213.html BANGALORE (Inde), 12 février - RIA Novosti. Des tests en vol de l'avion de cinquième génération (connu sous l�acronyme PAK-FA) sont prévus durant l'année 2009, a annoncé le patron de la corporation aéronautique russe Mig Mikhaïl Pogossian. "Les test en vol de l'avion de chasse polyvalent de cinquième génération seront lancés cette année", a dit M.Pogossian lors d'une conférence de presse en marge du salon AERO India-2009.

c'est comme ca que ca se colisionne dans les nuages, y'en a qui sont sourds, d'autre aveugles, =)